China's J-10 Cool~

[Carlo]

The biggest achievement of J-10 is not its capabilities or technology, but that China could develop and build their own 4th generation fighter, with their own avionics and (recently) engines. Perhaps it was influenced by Lavi, but anyway it is mostly Chinese technology. With proper funding, now China can go further, even develop a 5-th generation fighter (though I am quite sure PAK FA will fly and become operational before J-XX). China intends to get more independent from high-tech weapons supply from Russia, and I think in few decades they will be.

[Sukio]

Originally Posted by Carlo

The biggest achievement of J-10 is not its capabilities or technology, but that China could develop and build their own 4th generation fighter, with their own avionics and (recently) engines. Perhaps it was influenced by Lavi, but anyway it is mostly Chinese technology. With proper funding, now China can go further, even develop a 5-th generation fighter (though I am quite sure PAK FA will fly and become operational before J-XX). China intends to get more independent from high-tech weapons supply from Russia, and I think in few decades they will be.

I have seen it, and it looks sorta like the EF 2000, but none the less, I think it is a truly capable aircraft. Hands down China!

[zb10948]

Yes, China joined the club. But not the big club. Keep in mind that it's design was based on Lavi. It's domestic radar is an product of reverse engineered Phazotron Zhuk. Their active radar MRAAM, the SD-10, has a seekerhead that's again an "improved copy" of Soviet 9B-1103M seeker from the mid '80s (for R-27 family, eg. R-27AE). Their engines are "influenced" by Saturn's AL-31.

Main problem of China is their lack of serious R&D. Altrough they have astonishing industrial production capacity and quite good machine tools, they would have little success on the technology market if they couldn't "borrow and tweak" designs from someone else.

J-10 reminds me of YU-SuperSonik. In essence, YuSS would be based on Rafale as much as J-10 is based on Lavi, it would initially have licence-built French / British engines, French radar and Western/Eastern weapon systems. Only "smaller" avionics, such as comm. equipment, human support system and various other stuff would have been product of our research and development. Later on, we'd probably design and produce some major avionics system, again based on the foreign stuff we are licence-producing, just as Chinese are doing with J-10's engines and radar right now.

But hey, it's a good start, and it's an only possible start. Next generation should utilize more of indigenous R&D. And next even more, until they can manage everything by themselves. But, they have a somewhat long way to go. As i said, not in the big club, not in the club of "Russia, America and Europe".

[Carlo]

You are right. But I would consider "the big club" to be made of only two nations: USA and Russia. These are the only ones who have technology, infrastructure and human resources to build full 5-th generation planes (the fact that Russia does not have one in active duty is due mostly to economical problems). Yes, European countries have the Typhoon, the Gripen and the Rafale. But like you said, zb, they can't compete with the latest versions of Su-27 and MiG-29 (Su-35BM and MiG-35), even less with F-22.

[TovarishSamsonShekovich]

I'm waiting for some joint air defence rehearsals where China and the US would both participate, so perhaps we could expect some "battles" between the J-10 and some capable US fighters, then we know what the J-10 is capable of, but I think there is low chance for this kind of events to happen...

[Carlo]

A Russia-US air exercise is much more likely than a China-US one.

[TovarishSamsonShekovich]

Originally Posted by Carlo

A Russia-US air exercise is much more likely than a China-US one.

I do not think this way, but "Russian combat aircrafts" and "US combat aircrafts" joint excercises are likely, but not the Russian combat aircrafts of the Russian airforce, but from the airforces of other countries who are operators of Russian combat aircrafts, a classical example, the Indian airforce's Su-30 and US F-15.

[Carlo]

Russian relations with the US are better and closer (despite the recent problems) than China and the US. By the way, some times Russia made air exercises with NATO countries, like Norway.
Anyway, perhaps we can see J-10 in exercises against Western aircrafts, if Pakistan gets this fighter. China was supposed to export the J-10 to Pakistan, but couldn't so far because Russia didn't allow (the contract to deliver the Al-31 engines said that China needs Russian authorization to export this fighter). But now that J-10 is receiving Chinese engines, it is likely that Pakistan will get them.

[sicsok]

These conclusions about various countries' thinking, feelings, decisions of the future...just so mature! I am not that young as to know this much like what Russia or China will do even in much simpler fields than useless military games with the US or with Startoopers. But for those who like to predict things so well, I can tell an interesting fact from the past (hindsight is always good?):
Did anyone notice that the Su-27 and one of the canard varieties (maybe the 30MK or the 35?) was testflown and evaluated by Taiwanese pilots a couple of months earlier than by mainland China pilots? (In the Crimea). Who would have guessed that beforehand?
But if one cares enough, just check the archives.

[DeSoLaTe]

J-10 based on israeli fighter thyphoon with Russian technologies. Engine is said to be almost identical to the f-16's? J-XX chinese attempt at a Mig 1.44 THEY DONT HAVE the avionics to fly it, neither did Russia. Anyway, China is going to rule the world sooner or later... just not with the j-10 or the future failure XX